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Who Cares - Act One

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ColdBacon	Who Cares - Act One	Lead	[-]
Posts: 3740 (09/28/02 20:22:52) The Sauce Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Tags : None okay. you're remotely female. why don't you join in this experiment. tell us about your back stage experiences on the sets of late night comedy shows. tell us about how you ended up in h-town after all this time. and what everyone is dying to know. well, you know what we want. so just tell us. or if not. what about igby? so is it good or nothing but smoke and mirrors and ryan phillipe? He's hot enough. i might make an exception and get him in here too.
wc	Let's call this hanging around in the lobby, pre-show	#1	[-]
Posts: 893 (09/30/02 09:14:07) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	First, no one is dying to know anything. Except me. Im curious about Igby, which I havent seen but will in order to learn more about that child actor who was so intriguing in Altar Boys. I wonder what all this time is, and Im sort of dying to know more about this experiment. Science-wise. Objectives? Protocols? There is nothing to tell about back-stage experiences on the sets of late night comedy shows. At least not to anyone who has worked in a restaurant or in retail. There are people (actors/waiters/clerks) who are trapped in a horrible place between their real masters (producers/managers/managers) and customers who must be treated like masters (audience/patrons/shoppers) and it never, ever, occurs to the people that their freakish need for being the center of attention led them to be smack dab in the middle of people who are driving them crazy. Said people may be neurotic in ways that engender sympathy, or they may be narcissist, but in any case they are too needy and want too much from one so it's impossible to get a clear sense of what they think and feel and you can't have sex with them because... well, it's just no fun to dally with those who, in their heart of heart, consider the verb "score" most appropriate. (Although I am willing, at any time, to be just another notch on Robert Cray's guitar. If you see him, let him know.) No idea how I ended up in H-town after all this time. I dont know how anything in my life happened. Does any one? I mean, one could say, oh, well, Uncle Beamus was killed in that explosions so Aunt Mavis came to stay with us and she taught me to knit and after that it was only natural that Id end up in the International Ladies Garment Workers Union, which was, like so many unions at that time, in crisis, so I gravitated to leadership and ultimately became governor of Maine. But its hard to say how you ended up where you are. (Unless you are in jail or pregnant, because its usually just the one cause the exceptions being a bizarre case of mistaken identity or rape. Those exceptions are not statistically significant.) David Byrnes little pop ditty provides an accurate answer: letting the days go by I dont know what you want. Was that a conversational remark, or an effort to suggest and influence? And is there a difference between a conversational remark and effort to suggest and influence? Well, if you want to know something, I believe that all appliance makers, led by American-brand appliance makers, are in a vast international conspiracy to make sure that my effort to keep some foods cool or frozen cannot be met with convenience, style, and energy efficiency. One aspect of the vast international conspiracy against me is pretending that cool means close to freezing when, in fact, as far as cheese is concerned, cool means there would be no need to refrigerate this if I lived in a higher latitude.
ColdBacon	Re: Let's call this hanging around in the lobby, pre-show	#2	[-]
Posts: 3740 (10/09/02 06:07:47) The Sauce Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	we haven't worked out any objectives or protocols at this point. >their freakish need for being the center of attention uh-oh. ummm, well. moving on. yes. okay, so you won't provide very many details about your past. that's fine. i'm sure it's as checkered as they come. let me quote Ollinger from Pat Garret and Billy the Kid, 'I got my shotgun full of sixteen thin times, enough to spread you out like a crazy woman's quilt.' not that i would. we made a hug quilt in high school where everyone contributed a little square to it, and then it was sold for some exorbitant price at auction, i think the proceeds going to the something important like the school. let me just say i am truly glad i do not have that quilt in my possession. i think perhaps a crazy woman's quilt would even be more attractive than this was. >would be no need to refrigerate this if I lived in a higher latitude. here WC provides a subtle hint of her eminent migration to colorado via bismark. finally. allow me to ask if you enjoyed 24 hour PP, party people, which undoubtedly you have by now seen. Try to tell me the Ian Curtis actor was not incredible. An amazing and utterly convincing performance. i'm investigating this whole joy division thing now. and while i'm at it, i'm going to buy the 2 disc set for the group 'suicide' which was more overlooked quality from a mostly overlooked era.
wc	Will this day never end?	#3	[-]
Posts: 893 (10/09/02 11:12:14) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	It's thrilling that you, our own little Crispy Critter, believes - or is willing to flatter me by pretending to believe - my past is as checkered as they come. In fact, it's entirely ordinary. Except for the part where all the appliance makers in America are engaged in a vast conspiracy against me. That's a bit odd. I have not seen 24-Hour Party People, although I have been to Manchester and it's nasty. I haven't seen Igby Goes Down, either, although I have been to most places on the Eastern Seaboard, and I believe Igby has his adventure in Connecticut (which is also nasty) or some such haven of spice-shunning bloodless Talbot shoppers. Have seen The Salton Sea, and enjoyed it immensely, which does not necessarily mean it's any good - my overwhelming lust for Val Kilmer not only cancels out my hate and fear of speed freaks, but also trumps any flaws the Salton Sea may have. Bonus: You gotta admire Val for not losing weight to play a crank fiend. And Peter Sarsgaard, for whom I have no rabid groupie lust, is a terrific actor. Go Peter. What on earth does "shotgun full of sixteen thin times" mean? I have blasted clay pigeons with shotguns of every gage, with the choke scrunched down to the smallest spread, and never heard a word about "sixteen thin times." But, by mentioning a hero of the Olde West, you bring "Tombstone" to mind, a film in which the glorious Val Kilmer chew quite a lot of scenery as the ill, dying, and terribly droll Doc Holliday. Or maybe in the overly-long travesty the man with the best ass in movies plays another character from dime-novels. In any case, he is greenish and wears a white suit. Go Val. But about your experiment: I was beginning to think it was a failure, and now you admit you haven't even worked out any objectives or protocols. My guess is, attention is one of your objectives. So here, as a treat for you, something personal about me - although I read Clare's Knee, Kate, etc. which some interest, I assume that NO ONE reads any of this stuff. I had something lovely in here, about the possibility or our shared bad trait of avoiding work, balanced with the possibility that you aren't like that at all but rather full of energy and enthusiasm for the arts and what have you, with a caution that it was a bit sticky trying to see you as all that noble when half the cold bacon output is you baiting Eminem fans... but I lost track one of the times there was a posting error so now all those nice sentiments are gone for good. . And the whole Eggers thing is worrisome in the extreme. Can't you just accept the fact that he's a hack and a bastard and will always have move money, faster horses, younger women, better whiskey? I can't accept that, not gracefully, anyway - but I don't have aspirations to the muse. You've always seemed to, except for that one post about not wanting to review movies, which seems to be what people who are too cowardly to write screenplays want to do. Another personal tidbit, if you started keeping charts, you could tell how much work I had to do by the length of my posts. I've probably spent 20 minutes typing this (although I did use part of my brain to take a phone call during that time) and when you add that to the hour I spent reading the paper, and the hour I'm about to spend in a pointless meeting... the day is slipping away... Joy Division is a fine band, but aren't they ones who were hard-core white supremacist? It's always annoying, sometimes flat-out disturbing, when people can do something worthwhile very well in spite of being entirely awful human beings. P.S. This post was hard to post. May be full or errors or blank or otherwise balled up.
ColdBacon	a reply	#4	[-]
Posts: 3740 (10/13/02 10:03:06) The Sauce Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	>I have not seen 24-Hour Party People, although I have been to Manchester and it's nasty. I haven't seen Igby Goes Down, either, although I have been to most places on the Eastern Seaboard, and I believe Igby has his adventure in Connecticut (which is also nasty) or some such haven of spice-shunning bloodless Talbot shoppers. Have not seen The Salton Sea, although I have been to Salton, and it's nasty. I have been in Val Kilmer's underwear drawer, and I believe he shops at Talbots. shotgun full of dimes comes from the Peckinpah film PGBK with Kris Kristofferson. Val Kilmer is cool. Tombstone has its moments, but it's no Wild Bunch. >My guess is, attention is one of your objectives. now what sort of comment is that. > I assume that NO ONE reads any of this stuff. you don't have to assume. You can see the number of views in the little colum by the posts. > it was a bit sticky > when half the cold bacon output is you baiting Eminem fans yes, well. we do what we have to do. it's actually not written for them. the only advantage to having hundreds of eminem fans visit that page every day is the media power it confers. if i want to get a message to say thousands of people in a week. a message like, hey, eminem's new album will be delayed for a few weeks. or hey, eminem has been indicted for supporting al-quaida splinter cells. that sort of thing. >Can't you just accept the fact that he's a hack and a bastard and will always have more money, faster horses, younger women, better whiskey? like eminem, i don't know what i really think about eggers or what i want to say with the page. all i know is it amuses me to have it. and i seriously cannot finish his book. >(reviewing movies) seems to be what people who are too cowardly to write screenplays want to do. i don't think that's always the case. i think different people write criticism for different reasons. eliot wrote criticism of other works of fiction. would you say he was being 'cowardly'? >Joy Division is a fine band, but aren't they ones who were hard-core white supremacist? i have no idea.
wc	Hunky Dory	#5	[-]
Posts: 893 (10/14/02 11:19:36) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	>My guess is, attention is one of your objectives. >>now what sort of comment is that. Oh, somewhat catty, I suppose. You do, however, seem fussy about the attention given to David Eggars. And speaking of David, how does it feel to not know what you think. Obviously, you are not disinterested, so the quandary is that you have an emotional response which you cannot identify. Tell me about being in this state. I don't know anything about it. And maybe I was in an off temper because I suspected, even then, that Friday night was going to be one of those nights when half the people who came over for dinner stayed way late and drank all my booze so that now, if something wonderful or terrible happened I'd have to go to the liquor store or pretend to drown my sorrows in or celebrate with various cooking liqueurs. (An unselfish person would have enjoyed the fun and frolic, and would now be grateful for the thank you emails, but me with my bunker mentality, all I can think about is how all the hooch I put aside for a rainy day is gone.) The original remark about cowardly people writing screenplays comes from a little web site called Cold Bacon... it was a taunting homage. Eliot, if you mean my ol' pal T.S., was deeply engaged in fiction and poetry and, although very serious about the art, a downright fun loving reader and writer. There are not many cases in which it's a good idea to extrapolate from renowned poets to contemporary screenplay and fiction writers, and reviews. These critters are as different as neurotic lap dogs and working cattle dogs. Don't get confused just because they both bark. Of course, there's no point in compare and contrast with Emenim and Eggers, but that seems to be a game on this site. I continue to be a foursquare supporter of Em, and anti-Eggers. And I was anti-Eggers from day one. I've never been able to read his stuff, and most of McSweeney's makes my flesh crawl. It's so sad, though, that Eliot doesn't get enough credit for his high-spirited side. It's also interesting, at least to me, that when I have no major deliverables due, my brain doesn't work What about you, Bacon old bean, do you think better when you should be thinking about other things? When your posts seem tense and raggedy, does that mean you're under pressure, or that you're bored? Do you still consider Iggy Pop chairman of the bored and do you feel that his little moniker has more verve than Frank's aspirations to be "chairman of the board"?
ColdBacon	Re: Hunky Dory	#6	[-]
Posts: 3740 (10/14/02 14:05:26) The Sauce Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	no. actually. i really don't have any feelings about eggers either way. i equate him w/ JK Rowling. opium for the masses. transient. not important. my only feeling is that i suppose in a way, i blame him for my lack of a social life. i feel that he has stolen my social life from me. and is hording it away in new york. far from me. i feel that if he let go of it, it would come back here to me. and carry me somewhere else. and thus, his death would bring an end to my isolation and knowing despair. otherwise, i have no feelings for him either way. so you like eminem? why? he may be catchy, but so are so many other rappers and pop-entertainers? and others are just as raunchy, self-aggrandizing, tortured, truthful and whatever other criteria there are. why him? thinking more? better when some other work is due? couldn't say. i don't have due dates in my profession. and so for me, it's only a question of sleep and how much caffeine and how much time. i don't think it can be thought of in the terms you pose. well, it can be, but i haven't done it. i have answered your questions. now respond as you will, but be sure to tell more about you and your ways. i guess i know about your drinking habits now.
wc	this is kind of fun	#7	[-]
Posts: 893 (10/15/02 12:06:23) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	See, I can't equate JK Rowling and Eggers. First, I think Ms. Rowling would be scribbling her little adventures in a notebook no matter what. She's just a geek who got lucky - and I do think luck had a lot to do with it. I suspect that Ms. Rowling is so, as the kids say, "into" her little world, that, if fate had handed her a different set of editors, she might have hinkied the deal rather than be false to her beloved creation. As it happens, I find the whole Potter thing tedious, but I can respect Rowlings and most of her fan base for enjoying the fantasy. Unlike freaking Buffy fans, Potter's fellow geeks don't pretend the story is about something grand and complex. (I'm talking fans here; I shudder to think what papers are being presented at American Studies conferences.) Eggers, however, has absolutely no goal beyond having people bow down at the temple of eggers. To give him credit, at least understands and cast himself as the nth of cool. Of course, he's not a good looking rebel who lives by his own rules, he's a shrewd player who understands how to work the system. It makes me sad the people who would like to like literature fall for his con game. And that some people, I guess, can't admit that they are more interested in mean books about mean people having the opportunity to make everyone feel bad for being so mean to them... To be more coherent - I have more respect for someone who likes to see an action star kick ass than someone who finds Eggers profound. One of my pet peeves is the current vogue for autobiographical fiction - the idea that something has more gravitas just because it really happened just like that. (The guy who wrote the Garp book, of all people, has a couple of splendid essays about trying to beat this out of creative writing students. He says at one point that he can always tell what part of any short story is really true, because it's the most stupid part of the plot and the worst writing.) With the exception of Rick Bragg and Mary Karr, these folks seem to follow the Lillian Hellmann "make shit up" model of autobiography. Pam Houston and Lorrie Moore have some skills, unlike, say authors who have diseases to fall back on, but these skills are most obvious when they are writing about inanimate objects and, occasionally, other people. First, I've never understood why "this really happened to me!" is a good recommendation for a writer. (e.g., I would certainly like to know more about what life is like inside a maximum security facility for violent criminals... but I'm not so sure that people who've lived it can be trusted to have the skills or the motives to tell that story in a meaningful way.) Second, if you play the "I was victimized in this specific way yet ultimately got the cute guy and am your very best friend for a couple hundred pages" card, then it's pretty shitty to lie to your readers. And there's the irony of women writers trying to snuggle up to women readers by boo-hoo hooing about men who lie and connive to get one into the sack, in stories where they lie and connive to their readers. I see nothing wrong with writing romance novels for the shy gals and chubsters of America, just don't pretend it really happened to you just like that. I read something once, in a local paper, about Katherine Anne Porter being the stake you should through the heart of autobiographical fiction - the idea was that in her life, she lied about everything, even her own age to her husband, and wrote great stories that had, in the literary sense, truth. Also, it's difficult, well-nigh impossible to remember, if it's Eggers or Eggars. What is this job without deadlines? Where do I sign up? Interesting about Eggers stealing your social life. You know he works very hard at his, right? Now that he, himself, doesn't have time to answer all his fan mail, he has people do it for him. And he stays at readings until everyone has been attended to. (And then he makes sure word gets out, so that more people show up for the next reading. I never said he was stupid.) I have a social life, and it's not all it's cracked up to be. Cuts in on your reading time, and requires stylish clothing and remembering of names. Plus, if something horrible or wonderful happens to someone on the inner circle of your social life, well, there are obligations. If something horrible or wonderful happens to someone on an outer circle, then you have to figure out if your interest in "being there" is groupie like or ghoulish, or if your hesitation is just being a lazy-ass slacker who doesn't want to help a friend. And don't forget about the infighting. There might be social groups out there without ongoing soap operas, but I've been in various social groups since pre-school, and "Days of Our Lives" seems to be the blueprint.
ColdBacon	What a pity you must remain gagged.	#8	[-]
Posts: 3740 (10/15/02 19:55:38) The Sauce Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	i completely accept your explanation of Rowling. I still say it's not good reading and a very mediocre film. and I think you make another point about editors having a lot of influence. I personally wonder if their influence is too great. perhaps they function too much like producers (both movies, TV, music) in determining which stupidity should reach the public and when. you could blame the industry for the crap. but you could also blame the public who buy it. but how can you blame thirteen year olds for not knowing good music. let's blame the producers. Eggers? Whatever. Keep telling me insider poop on him as you get it bc that will give me material for my silly page. but between us, i could care as much or little for him as you want me to. the thing that stops me from 'working the system' is i'm sure the thing that stops many of us, who could, but choose not to. and that is that the thought is sickening. i am obviously not going to sit here and say i don't want to reach people. and don't want some attention while i'm at it. but it's not so much personal attention i want. it's my message i want (and someday, i may actually have one, and it will need a way of getting out, helping people, make better decisions) but i hope i can do so without being phony and manipulatory. if i manipulate someone, i hope it is so i can learn them how to not be manipulated. like a benevolent hacker. i know you know this about me, or you wouldn't stick around. a quotuplet 'that which does not kill us makes us stronger' and from an egg fan i heard one time 'eggers perfection destroys me.' so instead of making them stronger, eggers kills them. this is probably not an improvement in their level of cognitive functioning. >I have more respect for someone who likes to see an action star kick ass than someone who finds Eggers profound. which is why you like 'raiders' so much, besides good ole HF. >the idea that something has more gravitas just because it really happened yes. this is an interesting idea. let us harp/carp on it often. it plays into the whole 'email veritas' thing i do. it plays into this very project. 'the social experiment'. i really don't know whether this is just an alternate take on 'livejournal' and such. or no better than 'big brother'. or what. but i like to take 'clerks' as the model. that is -- my current theory is that all sorts of real people (in real life) say and do funny things, clever things, profound things. only you don't see it. but if we simply take it and shape it a little. in the right context, it can serve many of the same functions as art. perhaps the quality of discussion goes a long way to this end. and by quality, i don't just mean intelligence. this method of art-making is the operating principle of the guy who made 'the harder they come' about jamaica and the music scene and poverty there. his idea was to just let the story tell itself. of course, they made a movie and there was an editing room. but much of the acting/sub-plots were fairly real. this is in stark contrast to the kubrick model. total design. total control. total penis. both methods work. i think you get more famous with the kubrick method bc maybe it's harder to do or when it works, the credit naturally, perhaps rightly goes to the artist. in the jamaica situation, you see right here i talk about jamaica and how great their scene was and jimmy cliff and toots. and i can't even remember the damn director's name. eggers is no kubrick. but i can justify this public conversation simply under the aegis of transfer of knowledge and that any time people talk without throwing real firecrackers at each other is worthwhile. these conversations may not count as works of literature and this whole bulletin board may not count as anything but a bulletin board. but for the chance to discuss topics with smart people who are not (at least not currently) comp sci majors. it is well worth the modicum. finally - just bc it happened actually can make some stories more interesting but then that is called history. not fiction. the titanic, WWII, all of these stories do have more gravitas bc they really happened and bc our imaginations added to other information we get about the stories and the fact that these things will all happen again. all of that adds gravitas. spielberg knows it. the point you are making, that whether i fucked 4 men in one weekend or just 2, is hardly a factor in whether my stupid autoprint is worth anyone's time reading. it can be sucky and true or sucky and untrue. this principle is bourne out nicely in comparing Titanic to SPR. SPR moved people. it was intense. 'tank busters sir' oh my god. i never thought i would be rooting for matt demon. but sure enough i was. it was great. then there's the silly cheeseball Titanic, which i wouldn't see if you gave me $30. reality is a factor for sure. but it's not the only one. one last point. the frontline documentary on the mexican drug war is a way more entertaining watch than 'traffic' and, there, solid production + the reality factor team up to beat out traffic in best 3 out of 5 sets, and that's even w/ Benicio (the latin VJ Amritraj) looking good for the other side. >the Lillian Hellmann "make shit up" model of autobiography that's sounds funny. i think the other point of that paragraph was that you are reading way too much. >but I'm not so sure that people who've lived it can be trusted to have the skills or the motives to tell that story in a meaningful way. agreed. that's why you have book tasters. i make sure someone eats one or two pages of something before i read it. i also employ the smell test. many steps before i bother to read a single solitary slovo. > I see nothing wrong with writing romance novels for the shy gals and chubsters of America, just don't pretend it really happened to you just like that. agreed fellow non-chubster. >in her life, she lied about everything, even her own age to her husband, and wrote great stories that had, in the literary sense, truth. i'm lying about my age currently. i have gotten into this silly al barolo (that's Piemontese for imbroglio) with these little comp sci children. i am currently playing the 16 year jivaro girl, who likes to take heads mostly, but can be giving too. it's a long story. there was initially some praise among this clique of live journalists, which somehow soured and now i am enlightening them as to their true identities while showing the proper level of respect their tenure has earned. and now that the link to their site has drifted out of my log-list, it may be the end. 'is this the end of zombie shakespeare?' i fear so. they'll think it's because i moved on. i did not move on. just forgot the link. is that ironic enough to be a chapter in an eggers oeuvre? but if i get back on, i'll let you know so you can join the mini-partay. >What is this job without deadlines? Where do I sign up? to quote vladimir harkonnen, 'i will not tell you.' >And he stays at readings until everyone has been attended to. like i said, i love the poop, but where do you get this information. not even living in new york? or sleeping with or near neal pollack. >remembering of names. oh god, tell me about it. the remembering. here is my take on that. So you seem to have something to offer. You would be coming out with your works of fiction or near non-fiction except for the fact that you must be gagged. What a pity!
wc	At least you didn't suggest...	#9	[-]
Posts: 893 (10/16/02 13:41:09) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	... tis a pity I'm a whore... And we got so far without Simpsons refs, and now this. Everything I've mentioned about Eggers is from responsible publications. Although I agree 100 percent that regular folks can and do say funny and profound and instructive things, I say it isn't art until someone puts it on a platter on purpose. I believe the intent of the actor is part of the content. Home Depot clerks know many funny stories about stupid people, and tell them well if you ask with a leading question like "Is anyone dumb enough too?," but that doesn't make the clerks stand-up comics. Why this talk of gags? That's a little hostile, don't you think? Or you going for a whole "The Shadow" mysterious east tone with the talk of gags and awkward grammar?
ColdBacon	Re: At least you didn't suggest...	#10	[-]
Posts: 3740 (10/16/02 14:41:15) The Sauce Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	but when you talk about stand-up comics. you're right. except the truly funny stand-up comic is such a rarity. such a rarity. so rare. >I say it isn't art until someone puts it on a platter on purpose. agreed. i'll i'm saying is one needs to have that platter available at all times bc the examples will pop up left and right if you're paying attention. people often just don't see it. the gag comment was just a metaphor for your dual willingness and unwillingness to come. on the one hand, you are compelled to speak out on the issues. at the same time, you feel a sense of disenchantment, disillusionment, etc. and you gag yourself behind the 'who cares' emblem. it's a reasonable and understandable ambivalence. i do not fault you. and i am not the one putting a gag on you. if you click the link, you'll see that it's also just bc it was a cool Lynch line from Dune. i don't talk about the simpson's. at this time, i am more interested in harvey birdman and aqua teen hunger force.
wc	smell you later	#11	[-]
Posts: 893 (10/18/02 08:50:31) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	I can think of maybe seven standup comics who are funny. Presumably, there are more out there, but they're too busy being funny to get on TV. Platters - Are you suggesting that we could compare art to frozen yoghurt, and the metaphorical platter to a cup and spoon, so that anyone who walks about with a cup and spoon has endless opportunities for many flavors of fine frozen yoghurt? Cuz I disagree. Art must be created for the dialogue. I, with my mental platter, might be moved or gain sudden insight from a sight or sound or juxtaposition of same, but that's just the upside the abstract thinking - not art. If I were to write a monogram - "Reflections on Watching an Emu Attack a Llama and the Power of Land-Line Phone," which evoked a meaningful relationship between the similar mesmerizing motion of emu feathers and Llama fur as the creatures run through their enclosure, and the connection - literally as beasts locked in battle and spiritually as creatures on the earth - between those two creatures and the connection between people linked by wire and the mesmerizing motion of computer models of graphed sound waves... that might be bad art. Simply reporting that something moved you counts for shit. (The blog excerpt you posted proves this, I think.) And gathering up some examples of something or other which, as a class, has meaning to at least one group also counts for shit. Example - the Museum of Women in Dallas (or maybe Fort Worth) has a display, which I think suits your definition of a platter, of lacy nothings and undergarment ads from the last century. It's mildly interesting, but it's not art and, thanks to the total lack of context or supporting information, not even historically interesting. (I've read reams about the famous Howard Hughes pointy bra, and not one word about how many were sold and what percentage of the American bra market those sales represented and what choices were available to the bra-buying women and trannies....) And there are troublesome questions about art and commerce - soap operas, I think, can't be art because the narrative, that which is suppose to speak to the viewer, is governed by contract negotiations and vacation schedules and assumptions about what other programs the show will compete with that day. And I think movies suffer because lawyers control so much. Stepmother would have been horrible in any case, but it doesn't help that the two female leads get, to the second, exactly the same amount of screen time, broken down by close-up, mid-shot, three-quarter on screen with more than one other person, etc. ect. ect. Over-produced pop like Britney... I'm not sure. I suspect it's possible for an elderly gay man or that women who never dates because she's too busy writing all the songs you hear on the radio to write a song, understanding that the song is written for a production style and an audience, that is artistic. But I don't know ~if~ that happens. Obviously, all artists have made decisions based on what their society would allow, what their government would allow, what would woo patrons, but there's a clear line between being reasonable and letting a dozen corporate honchos have meeting to make major decisions. For instance, had Tom Hanks wanted the lead in "American Psycho," the grooming scenes and the being buff and shirtless scenes would be out, because Tom Hanks couldn't do them. I don't know what we have in their place, but the image of the psycho as a high-strung, fit, and well-groomed thoroughbred would be gone. And a decicions based on Tom Hanks juice is a very different thing than a decision based on Bret Easton Ellis' ideas about what would and would not fly with his intended audience and society as a whole. My world does not include Harvey Birdmen or Aqua Teens. Why have you dumped Oscar for the Yanimomi or whoever? Does this mean you're more insterested in anthro than writing?
wc	babe?	#12	[-]
Posts: 893 (10/26/02 10:24:52) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Was that for me or CSE? Have you not been drinking Zima again?
ColdBacon	Re: babe?	#13	[-]
Posts: 3740 (10/26/02 10:41:19) The Sauce Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	she is referring to another post in which i somehow asked if i could have sex but it was unclear to whom i was speaking. the answer is: i was not drinking Zima again. i had just returned from dinner out. and i had been drinking, in fact. Guys are so obvious, predictable, pathetic.
wc	Nick Drake isn't overrated	#14	[-]
Posts: 893 (10/27/02 01:08:50) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Gertrude I think, covered the obvious, predictable, and pathetic aspects of your sex when she called y'all "much of a muchness." But seriously - I know the posting times and counters for EZboard are all screwy, but it looks like you got in early. Does that mean you and your guy friends get puking drunk and have to go home that early? Or that, even though the bars and clubs of this great nation are crawling with females (and males, or whatever you want) with whom you might get a little something going, you run home instead of trying to meet a nice girl (or guy, or whatever)? Frankly, your recent tone is upsetting. Did you just get dumped or shot down or something? Where is the feckless, lighthearted-nearly-to-the-point-of-shallow bacon of our salad days?
ColdBacon	Re: Nick Drake isn't overrated	#15	[-]
Posts: 3740 (10/27/02 10:15:28) The Sauce Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	she is referring to the fact that my post was at 10:30 pm on saturday. the explanation for this is simple. as i've said before, i don't have to go out to get drunk. it's all about clear malt beverages. Not ZIMA. i swear not Zima. but yes, i was at home, alone, drinking. as usual. i used to be able to work until a reasonable hour before i started into the booze. but lately, i've been starting earlier and earlier. it's gotten so i've started using Dragon Nat Speaking to compose articles and posts bc my typing ability seems to go faster than the speech. feckless? isn't it funny how W.C. has her own version of what 'bacon' is and should be, or more precisely, what is and what should never be?
wc	early results	#16	[-]
Posts: 893 (10/27/02 16:58:57) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	she is no longer enjoyng the social experiment
ColdBacon	Re: early results	#17	[-]
Posts: 3740 (10/27/02 19:42:08) The Sauce Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	did you wait for the soundtrack to load? if you did, and you are still ready to give up on lil ol' me. then i guess all i can say is, you wouldn't be the first to bale (?bail) on the social experiment. I think what has happened here is you have fallen in love with the idea of someone who can spell and who 'just knows' all sorts of words. not someone who has a dictionary under random piles of other things he is supposed to be working on (i say piles as it is always on the move because i never can remember the meaning of anything). and who has myriad friends constantly emailing him little spelling corrections1 but if we must, then let us part. peacefully. but sadly. 1 for which he remains deeply indebted and grateful.
wc	I love a man in uniform	#18	[-]
Posts: 893 (10/28/02 14:35:14) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	I only found out about the soundtrack recently. There is no music today. What should I be hearing and what does it mean? Bowie? Cojunto? The Dukes of Hazard theme??? It would serve you right if I pretended not to know what myriad means. Why don't you go attend to Dearest Kate while I finish gagging about having this Princess Vee moment. P.S. You realize, don't you, that most of us are in love with Gilberto. And I bet you are too, a little bit.
ColdBacon	Re: I love a man in uniform	#19	[-]
Posts: 3740 (10/28/02 17:25:35) The Sauce Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	you can't make me jealous of gilberto. for i am already jealous of him. you need faster speed/speakers and you will get the music. i know it works. it's like for 2-3 posts back by now. it's not going to be as amusing at this point. i would attend to dearest kate but she is having problems posting. apparently ezboard won't take her posts from her computer. this is sort of grounding our public liaison. also, one hopes her fiancee has no hand in it. and yes. you have been having a princess vee moment. 'kelly watch the stars' dropped out long ago. maybe i will replace Kate with K? and 'clare's knee' certainly needs a kick in the not knee. the funny part about fuckfests is that you can't join if you don't have a swinging partner. that is to say, a single male cannot just show up. but how does a single male acquire a swinging partner if not at a swinging club? i mean, you just don't take a girl on a date and say, hey, let's go to a swing club. at least i don't. maybe we should invite gilberto? wait. i have an idea.
wc	mucho sexo	#20	[-]
Posts: 893 (10/29/02 12:00:43) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	What's with this talk of fuckfests? Have we drifted back in time to an old-school BBS? I realize that many people use the internet almost exclusively for porn and lewd thrills, but for me and many females, the best aspect of being oline is that there are no men in the room (although they might be in the next cube), allowing for a refreshing break from gender roles and such baggage. Why don't you go amuse yourself with "rate a rack" and then come back and tell me about the last book you read. Tech note: I almost never hear music on this site (except in flash), but I know for a fact that one of the times I heard it was on dial-up. Go figure.

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